My experiences with P.O.S.’s 2009 release Never Better highlight how these things are supposed to happen. First, I read a review of Never Better from Punknews.org’s Aubin Paul in which he heaps praise upon the disc (trusted filter) and not a week later, I find that the label, Rhymesayers, sent a radio clean copy of the disc to my campus’ radio station (large-scale promotion). Intrigued, I got my hands on it… (critics getting access). I would listen to it for three months straight in the deep, neverending snow of Western Pennsylvania, which, while not a perfect corollary for Minnesota’s soul-crushing winters, is close enough to create a personal connection.

Never Better is unquestionably a hip-hop record. It’s got beats, and the rhymes aren’t bad, but that’s not the interesting part. The interesting part is that the beats are more often than not, dark, complex and abrasive as fuck. Apparently, there’s there Doomtree crew that P.O.S. is a part of that comes in to add counterweights to the rhymes, but I’m not fooled, I know gang vocals when I hear them.

In short, Never Better is the most hardcore punk friendly hip-hop record I’ve ever heard. It is now the standard for something. Never Better is what is supposed to happen when “punk” is added as a suffix to musical genre hopping. It is abrasive, it is confrontational and it is eminently aggressive and that’s why it caught my attention and subsequent imagination. I did an interview with P.O.S. (Stefon Alexander) in May of 2009… and six months later (The Editor takes full responsibility – Jordan), it’s all finally put together for your perusal.

Pastepunk: Talk to me about CONVERGE…

Stef: CONVERGE is great. CONVERGE has been a great band to listen to since Jane Doe all the way up through, as far as I’m concerned, that’s when I got into them. Great band. I’ve had the pleasure of seeing CONVERGE a couple times and those guys put on a great show. I was on tour with ATMOSPHERE in Tornoto, three, four years ago.They were playing the small room while ATMOSPHERE was playing the big room, and I was opening for ATMOSPHERE, and I just happened to notice they were playing, skip ATMOSPHERE’s set, go watch them. I met Jake afterwards and that’s how I got those two shirts, I have two shirts he designed for me, I met him at that show, gave him my first record Ipecac Neat, Wes from Burlesque told me that on CONVERGE’s site, he had put Ipecac Neat as one of his favorite records of the year, so I just wrote him an email saying “You wanna do some shirts?” and he said “Absolutely”. It was pretty exciting for me.

Pastepunk: If I’m going to continue namedropping bands and stuff, because apparently, that’s what I’m supposed to do in these interviews to let you know I’m serious, I have to mention that you’ve had a song called “Lifetime… Kid Dynamite” and you’ve had Jay Shevchuk on Never Better, so, dude, when is Dan Yemin showing up on one of these things?

Stef: *laughs* Me and Dan Yemin have been talking about collaborating for almost two years now, just because, I met him at the Gainesville Fest a long time ago, and we already known that we were aware of each other through various correspondence via DILLINGER FOUR in Minneapolis, Paddy from D4 hung out from PAINT IT BLACK when they were in town and I was on tour, so I couldn’t go to the show… so I named that song “Lifetime…Kid Dynamite” just because the chorus has a reference to LIFETIME’s in it and I just figured it would be a good name for the song and apparently both Dan and Jason are fans of hip-hop, that was cool. I’m hoping me and Dan can collaborate in a big way, I’d like to do more just have him come sing out something or play guitar, I wanna do something big with that guy.

Pastepunk: Are we talking possible record with Craig Finn big?

Stef: *laughs* I’d like to make a handful of songs with Dan and see what we come out with, if we came up with something really cool, maybe we could find some way to put it out. Craig Finn is like on top of the universe right now, I’m not sure if we’ll be working any time soon, not because we don’t want to, but just because that dude’s busy.

Pastepunk: When are you’re going on Warped Tour this year?

Stef: I’m actually doing, a couple days with CURSIVE at the end of next week, the 7th through the 9th, I’m doing a week in the UK with THE BOUNCING SOULS, then I’m going straight to Warped Tour from that, that’s kind of huge.

Pastepunk: I assume you’re going to be in Chicago for Burning Fight?

Stef: I’m not sure. I hope so, but I’m not sure. My schedule has been a little bit mayhem since the record came out in February, if I’m not playing it or stuff like that, I’m not sure if I can plan on being places even when I want to. It sounds like a lot of fun, I… I’m gonna be out of town for my son’s birthday, so he’s going to be flying out to… Orlando to meet me on the Warped Tour with his mom and we’re gonna hang out there. I can’t really plan on doing all the stuff I want to do this year, I just have to keep my nose in it and grind it out.

Pastepunk: Why did you want to do the phoner as opposed to answer the questions via email?

Stef: It’s a drag. *laughs* Aside from the homework quality aspect of it, cause that’s what it is, if you do an interview email it comes off like writing an essay about yourself, know what I’m saying? That’s kind of a drag, I’d much rather hear somebody’s voice and get a vibe for where they’re asking the questions from. Sometimes it’s hard to figure out what somebody means… what they need to know about whatever subject it might be, I’d much rather hear something in someone’s voice.

Pastepunk: Yeah. Text lacks that context…

Stef: Yeah! Especially when trying to promote myself or my record, it’s really hard to get a vibe, you know? Sometimes I end up being a dork in those email interviews, make stuff up or or not really make stuff up or treat it a little more silly than what it could be, because I don’t know the tone, you know?

Pastepunk: Speaking of tone, let’s change gears drastically, let’s start with Dessa’s verse in “Low Light, Low Life” — Did she write that?

Stef: She writes all of her verses. Everybody in Doomtree, everybody on Rhymesayers, if they say it out loud, they wrote it with their own hands and their own pen. Dessa actually just wrote a book and put it out, so she’s not waiting for anyone else to write verses for her… but yeah, that’s hers.

Pastepunk: Is the Russell she mentioned supposed to be Bertrand Russell or someone else?

Stef: Absolutely.  Most people don’t pick that up at all. I actually wouldn’t even know that if she told me when I asked her. That’s actually a good pick up, a lot of people don’t catch that reference, she’s a psychology major, too…

Pastepunk: From De La Souls, a reference to BANE’s Ante Up?

Stef: No, that’s just a reference to poker. I’ve been trying to have the direct quotes down to a minimum. My first record, I don’t know if you’re familiar with it, but it was just littered with direct quotes from bands and direct quotes from things that I liked and a lot of people who are aware of the music I like, really aware, treat it the homage that it is, but people who aren’t aware assume I wrote it. I feel like Audition and coming into Never Better, I didn’t want to make any direct quotes anymore unless they were necessary to the song.

Pastepunk: But if Dan Yemin asked you to put in a direct quote…

Stef: Haha… I mean, being asked is totally from coming up with it in your own writing, but definitely I would flat out cover the first KID DYNAMITE record. Flat out.

Pastepunk: Now that you’ve brought up and by brought it up, I mean least hinted at it, what was your first experience with a Yemin project whether it was LIFETIME or KID D or whatever else…

Stef: My first experiences was LIFETIME, hearing Jersey’s Best Dancers first. I probably heard that one first, I was into it. Then, years later, I was pretty over punk rock, I was pretty much done finding new bands I was into, that first KID DYNAMITE record came out and blew my mind, that’s what it was about, as soon as that happened, I’m personally a bigger fan of KID DYNAMITE than I was of LIFETIME just because I’m just more of a fan of that style, but… I’m steadily appreciative of the kids

Pastepunk: I forget your exact quote, but you talked about how a bunch of bands today are lesser versions of LIFETIME…

Stef: Yeah, there’s a lot of them, not even lesser versions of LIFETIME, but lesser versions of older bands, I’m not sure how old you are…

Pastepunk: I’m 22, but…

Stef: But you’re aware of what’s classic…

Pastepunk: Yes. If you define classic as mid 90′s then yes, I have a respect for it and I have a vague idea of what’s going on.

Stef: Yeah, like pre-screamo, you know… pre the title of screamo.

Pastepunk: Pre-THURSDAY making screamo a four letter word… that’s not to diss THURSDAY…

Stef: They count as classic to me, they count as originators. But, they get slept on nowadays like LIFETIME gets slept on nowadays because these kids just know what the watered-down versions sounds like.

Pastepunk: When I have to explain to people that there was an emo band before FALL OUT BOY…

Stef: I have no disrespect for FALL OUT BOY either, because on the 2004 Warped Tour when I was selling merch for ATMOSPHERE, FALL OUT BOY was playing one of these little side stages, they didn’t have a record deal, they put up their own crap and they had a bigger crowd than the main stages and it was like man, this band is gonna blow up on their own work, know what I’m sayin’? I can’t be mad at them for that, because, it’s not like they like changed what they were doing? They did it. Can’t be mad at that. But, I can’t give them more credit than they deserve…

Pastepunk: It feels strange to say, but I like FALL OUT BOY’s records, it’s just… and I like that FALL OUT BOY will say no to Proposition 8 before it became cool to do so, before the week where people went OHSHITS!!, this might actually pass, they were talking about it, it’s just for me, there’s a cult of personality around Pete Wentz that is more than what I’m used to from bands that size.

Stef: Yeah….I don’t know. If you’ve got the mouthpiece in your band, whether you’re loved or hated, you get a lot of credit. You do what you’ve gotta do. He’s the odd bass player who is also the lyricist and essentially non-singing frontman for the band, that’s a weird place to be. I don’t know this guy, know what I’m saying…

Pastepunk: And I don’t either….

Stef: But he does get a lot of it. He gets a lot of press, he apparently has a lot going for him.

Pastepunk: Yes yes yes and because I’m from Chicago, and also because I can read Wikipedia, there’s a history of the band, the drummer I think was in RACETRAITOR (And Pete was in ARMA ANGELUS – Ed.), so I don’t think they’re insincere, it’s just FALL OUT BOY has their own, they have their own aura that I can look at from outside and go I like what you guys are doing and I’m a fan, but that carries with it some pretty heavy connotations.

Stef: Its true. A lot of people don’t know the history, but most people don’t care. Most people don’t care about credibility, when you’re a band like FALL OUT BOY that’s done so well, it’s a very small portion of your fans that care about the bands you were in before. I don’t know. It’s like that with everybody that “makes it”. Those were airquotes.

Pastepunk: I don’t want to single FALL OUT BOY out here, because you can say the same thing for tons of other bands…A nyway, I’ve asked you a bunch of questions about hiphop…wait. I’ve asked you a bunch of questions about punk, not to turn this into a dumb binary or duality (It’s hip-hop OR punk) so tell me about hip-hop. There’s the other…

Stef: I mean, I grew up, 6th grade, meeting older kids that listened to BLACK FLAG and MINOR THREAT, that’s what I did. When I was on my own time, not doing homework, not doing other crap, I was skateboarding around my neighborhood with older kids listening to MINOR THREAT, BLACK FLAG, first RANCID record, mid-school NOFX…

Pastepunk: Punk in Drublic?

Stef: Before Punk in Drublic, but around that area. Two Heebs and a Bean and then Punk in Drublic came out, I was getting into it. I liked the speed of it, I liked the energy, I liked the vibe, cause it was all about let’s do it together. But whenever I was with my family, my mom, I was listening to funk and soul and adult contemporary. When I was with my cousins, I was listening to SOUTH CENTRAL CARTEL, DRE and SNOOP DOGG, APACHE INDIAN like, SCARFACE, gangsta rap. I liked to soak it all wherever I could from whoever, I’m a fan of music, first and foremost. And I have been a fan of music since I realized that you could find music. Ever since I realized there are people who made a living with music, that was what I wanted to do. It’s not about a duality so much as it’s about… making music.

Pastepunk: So, talk about the first DE LA record or DRE or SNOOP you picked up because I very sincerely do not want to turn this into a “hip hop OR punk rock” interview, but I want to hear about the synthesis and the coalescing of everything…

Stef: For me, listening to Doggie Style, it had to be in 5th or 6th grade, listening to that with my neighbor, we were listening to it and we really loved it…what I took from it was I took the patterns, the patterns being the way rhymes are put together, choppy choppy choppy choppy cha… whatever it is. I took that stuff, I took the cool, but as far as when I was on my own or rapping to myself, I felt like an idiot saying that stuff, because it wasn’t really me.

I remember there was a specific time me and a kid down the street Randy Bana (??) was the kid and he got an old school hiphop tape, this was the 6th grade, he gets an old school hiphop tape and it’s got the original version of the SLICK RICK song that SNOOP DOGG covered La Di Da Di we only heard the SNOOP DOGG version so when we listened to this old school hip hop tape and we hear the exact same song except he changed it to be SNOOP DOGG instead of being SLICK RICK, Randy was furious. He was just like “why would he do that, he’s not even real”, like he just stole all this other guy’s words and I remember being like “yeah, wow, I guess I didn’t even think about it like that”. I remember that affecting me and making me not want to listen to rap very much anymore, think “maybe there’s a real version somewhere.”

It wasn’t much longer, a couple years, when my friend Grant introduced me to COMPANY FLOW, man, probably between 8th and 9th grade, maybe it was a couple years later, either way, MOS DEF, PHAROE MONHC early Raucous records, early Rhymesayers, the early Headshots tapes. They kind of put hip-hop into a context that I could appreciate as somebody, I didn’t want to say bitch, who had no problem with foul language but also would like MINOR THREAT songs, even if you’re not about what they’re about, you can tell those songs are about something. They’re definitely not talking about going to a party and fucking bitches… Imagine that.

So I don’t know if there was ever a conscious thing in my head that changed anything, it was just when I started making rap music, which I started when I wrote my first rap song when I was in 5th grade, but I never wrote seriously, raps every once and a while, freestyle with friends, but I didn’t start taking rap seriously until I was 18 and the bass player to the band I’d been in since 9th grade had to go to college, so I didn’t have anything to do, so I panicked, “what am I gonna do” so I joined the band CADILLAC BLINDSIDE, I played drums for them for 10 months…

Pastepunk: Did you ever record anything with them?

Stef: I recorded all the demos for the first record and then I told the guitar player that I thought we sounded too much like THE GET UP KIDS and we should make some harder music and then I got kicked out the next week… they’re like “now you can go start your hardcore band.” So, I started BUILDING BETTER BOMBS and I started rapping all pretty much within the same six month period, I started rapping really seriously, me and Issac formed BUILDING BETTER BOMBS as me him and a drum machine for three years, then uhhh, yeah. That’s what I was doing to make up for the fact that the band I fronted had to break up because my best friend and the bass player moved to college. When you rap, you don’t need anyone else to be around you, you just need to find some beats, you know? That’s what that’s about. It was never about I’m gonna switch from this to this or “I like this and this and I’m gonna figure out a way to mash ‘em together.” I love to make music. I don’t really care what music. I love hip hop, I love punk, I love hardcore what’re you going to do now? You know?

Pastepunk: Yeah…so one of the stories of P.O.S. is Milo Goes to College?

Stef: *laughs* Yeah, college situation.

Pastepunk: You mentioned the old Rhymesayers Headshots tapes and you said in an earlier interview that you and your friends used to drive around with them in your car and…

Stef: Haha… I know what you’re going to say.

Pastepunk: So, which ones did you like?

Stef: I mean, I liked a lot of them, but, I mean, we pretty much had EFFORT and INDUSTRIAL WARFARE, it’s not a matter… I liked the TECHNIQUE song with EYEDEA AND ABILITIES, DECK OF CARDS song, ATMOSPHERE, like there’s tons of great songs all over those tapes, but like, me, Amy K, Luke, Nick……. MIKE MICTLAN and me would figure out a combination of hall passes and one of us or two of us would get in the trunk and we’d escape school…

Pastepunk: The trunk? You stuffed your friends in the trunk?

Stef: Oh yeah. There was only a certain amount of passes allowed in the school, so we’d leave the school… So we’d just drive around the neighborhood, smoking cigarettes, listening to these rap tapes. Listening to ‘em, getting inspired by the good songs, being excited because they were from Minnesota and then freestyling over the songs we didn’t think were as good. *laughs* And I couldn’t even tell you which ones those were, because, freestyling. But! For the most part, we were really into it.

Pastepunk: The entire point of that was to make you laugh and and to make you a little bit uncomfortable…

Stef: They both worked.

Pastepunk: Sweet. That is what I’m supposed to do. Talk to me about Minnesota, because I hear the names of these characters, but there’s not a useful context in which to put them…

Stef: Minnesota, right now. I’ll start there. Minnesota, right now as far as music goes as far as people go, is it’s one of those… insanely liberal, insanely fresh, very ,very diverse economically, racially, everything, you know what I’m saying. that’s what it’s like. Minneapolis, St. Paul, Minnesota in general, know what I’m saying? A lot of McCain supporters on the fringe. Lotta Obama supporters everywhere and nevermind the bollocks, know what I’m saying? It’s a great place for anyone that’s down to… I’ll say it like this, it’s not the smallest pond, but it’s def not the biggest pond. If you have a good sense of drive if you know what you’re trying to do, you can make it happen here. Now, whether or not you can parlay that into a national thing or not, totally different story, but you can definitely get the practice in here, know what I’m saying? It’s not so big that you’ll never ever ever ever ever get noticed, but also there’s no major labels here, there’s no major anything here, except for Best Buy and Target in the mall.

Pastepunk: Yeah, but there’s First Avenue and Triple Rock, right?

Stef: Yeah, these are great places but that’s a club…

Pastepunk: Yeah, but you also have… I don’t want to say the cult of D4, but the circus around D4…

Stef: Not just D4, REPLACEMENTS, PRINCE, HUSKER DU, D4, ATMOSPHERE, HOLD STEADY, LFTR PLLR, before that. It’s a great huge music scene, but if you get into, you gotta realize there’s no record labels here. No real huge record labels here that are gonna propel you into stardom, without you doing all of the work you can possibly do and that’s something you gotta know if you’re gonna do it here. That’s the way it’s been, that’s the way it’s always been. We’re never gonna get a Warner Brothers office here. Know what I’m saying? And we don’t want it, we got, man, the Midwest is good for that, look at Saddle Creek, dude, that’s Omaha, that’s a smaller place than here, they set it off and they charged their own way.

Pastepunk: I’m trying to think of another label from the Midwest and the only one that’s coming up is Initial and that folded.

Stef: Initial, Blood of the Young, Amphetamine Reptile, Saddle Creek…

Pastepunk: Oh! Touch and Go!

Stef: Touch and Go, Southern… There’s been a lot of legendary record labels out here, but it’s all niche stuff. It’s all about finding the market that they’re aimed at and then working that market and doing it with honesty the best way they can and I feel like that’s what it’s gonna be out here. I feel like that’s one of the better parts of being a flyover state if you’ve got the drive to do it yourself.

Pastepunk: It’s funny that you mention Warner Brothers… I think your publicist works for Warner Music Group…

Stef: ILG – Independent Label Group

Pastepunk: Yeah, that includes East/West, I think?

Stef: Yeah. ILG.

James: That’s another conversation I don’t want to start, because it’s so insipid, and it’s so ughhhhh.

Stef: What do you mean?

Pastepunk: The indie versus major thing, because… I feel like that’s a conversation path that ends in nothing really interesting for you or me. And it’s been done to death every where else.

Stef: I mean, I guess…The way Rhymesayers has worked out with ILG, not Warner Brothers, ILG is the independent label group, it’s  essentially distribution, distribution and assistance if you know your Rhymesayers history, as ATMOSPHERE’s gotten bigger and bigger every record label that there’s ever been has knocked on the door of Rhymesayers, like lemme buy out, lemme do this, lemme do that, and Rhymesayers is just, you know, the people who work there, the head honchos in charge, Siddiq in the office, he’s a smart dude, he understands what the artist on his label are worth and he understands what major labels actually do, as opposed to what they’ve been able to do for themselves for 10 plus years now. If you’re gonna get into a conversation about Rhymesayers working with a major label nowadays, you’re gonna understand that it’s nothing like any record deal you’ve heard of ever, a) and b) Rhymesayers is 100% independent and has been from day one. Anything that anybody else is getting or assisting with is going to be on an artist to artist basis, completely based on the original contract Rhymesayers had for that artist. Meaning, if we’re working with another label, it’s because that label bent to work with us. Not that we reached out to work with them, it’s because they bent to work with us.

Pastepunk: And that’s why I don’t want to have this conversation because it devolves into contracts and assumptions and this is what this is, what this person expects to take from the conversation, the other party is going to get defensive and then ugh. In short, message boards…haha… But yeah, didn’t Epitaph work with Rhymesayers for… three minutes?

Stef: Epitaph, that was when Rhymesayers was still trying to up the distribution and how that works is and I don’t know the whole story, but I know Rhymesayers was distributed by smaller distributor then a slightly bigger one, then a slightly bigger one, then Epitaph tried their hand at it, they did two records, they did an ATMOSPHERE record, Seven’s Travels and EYDEA AND ABILITIES record and then that worked out really well and they liked what they got from it, but going through another label wasn’t the ultimate goal, and I think that from that point on they worked with a larger distributor, but then again, I don’t work in the office, I don’t know the ins and outs.

Pastepunk: Again, that’s one of the reasons why I don’t like having the indie major conversation, because the standard positions are FUGAZI (whom I have much love, respect for, etc) and ughhhh. I’m sorry, I’m very burnt out. I hate it.

Stef: I’ll say this: I’ve got a trillion times respect for a band like BAD RELIGION, who made all the records they ever needed to make and then were like “yeah, I’ll try out this major deal for a minute” and then when their contact was up, they were like “back to where we started” without losing fans, without doing anything, aside from maybe, maybe getting a few more fans. That’s one position I can respect, they stayed where they wanted to be for so long that when they decided like to level up or whatever it was, they didn’t have to change what they were doing because they had already set up what they were doing and that’s what the label was looking for. Whatever. I hate these labels. I’ve never sent a demo out to anyone in my life.

Pastepunk: For real? Because I thought you said that one of the reasons Rhymesayers got to you so quick was they were afraid you were going somewhere else…

Stef: They were, because people were coming to me. Tommy Boy came to me. A bunch of labels came at me, but I didn’t take those offers and I certainly didn’t send them anything to be like “Hey, sign me.” *laughs* There’s a vibe in Minneapolis, you make records. You don’t make demos. If you make demos, you make demos for your records. You don’t make a demo and then send it off to a major label, that seems counter productive. I’d much rather just make the songs I want to make and put them out.

Pastepunk: Yeah…and speaking of demos. There’s someone out there that has a lot of Never Better demos that are never going to be released. I’ve heard two different stories on this. The Never Better that you put out was the second batch of songs… what I’ve heard that it got stolen or rained on…

Stef: I was on tour with GYM CLASS HEROES, in Ohio somewhere, Cincinnati, no no, Columbus, my van got broken into in the hotel that we were staying at and they took a case with hard drives and MPCs, which are microphones, and just a lot of stuff I’d been working on, but that was only like 30% vocally, it was maybe 70% beats…

Pastepunk: Beats are expensive, though…

Stef: Chances are, the people who stole my shit don’t even know what they stole. To be totally straight. I don’t know if the average person knows what an MPC is, let alone to how to plug it in and make it work. If they sold it to a pawn shop, I know when I buy shit at a pawn shop the first thing I do is erase what’s on it and start over with my own shit. Hopefully that’s what happened, because I would hate to provide beats for some horrible emcee, haha…

Pastepunk: I really really like Never Better and here’s how you know. It’s the first CD that I went out to when I was in D.C. on spring break. I just looked around a Best Buy, I saw that they had it and I didn’t even bother to look at the price.

Stef: Nice, that’s excellent.

Pastepunk: And the reason why I mention this is not just because of the songs on there, but the packaging. How did that come together and how Rhymesayers let you get away with that, because I have to imagine that shit’s expensive…

Stef: It’s kind of expensive. It’s not like a nightmare, but it’s not… It came together because the overarching theme of the record is to do something for yourself. The record seems like a drag upon first listen, after a couple listens, you get the vibe that these are hopeful optimistic songs about doing something for yourself. We wanted to make something where I didn’t pick what the art looked like, Eric didn’t pick what the art looked like, Eric Carlson, my favorite artist in Minneapolis, I gave him the rough versions of the songs before it was mixed and that’s it he just whipped up art for the songs and we went back and forth on it over and over and over again. Convincing Rhymesayers to do this thing was definitely a compromise. That digipak that it comes in is the only digipak of its kind ever. They made that, clear plastic digipak, they made it for this project. We initially asked for 32 panels… but they weren’t having that.

Pastepunk: 32 panels?!?

Stef: A lot of panels. I’m pretty sure it was 32. And that was a combination of the paper ones and a bunch of transparencies I think we had six or seven more transparencies that weren’t on there and we just found a happy medium between what we initially wanted, what they wanted and then we found a middle between that to make it affordable. Rhymesayers has built up some good relationships with manufacturers over the years and we found someone who was down to do it for as cheap as it could be done.

Pastepunk: Save those extra transparencies for the deluxe reissue in a year…

Stef: Oh man, no. I think when it’s reissued it’s going to come out in a normal, standard, digipak because…

Pastepunk: Haha… no no no no, I don’t think you understand. What you do with a deluxe reissue is first you put a black slipcase over it, that’s what’s important, then what you do is you find a up a couple shitty demos and a couple acoustic songs you whipped up in someone’s basement somewhere and then you sell it again to the fans!

Stef: That’s not quite my style. I feel like… it’ll come out in a digipak, we did make six or seven videos for the record so maybe we’ll put those on there, but I don’t like the sliptop guy for now… I think I’ll just go with a standard bio digipak.

Pastepunk: The packaging is fantastic, and when I got back from D.C. I realized I lost one of the transparencies…but the cover I’ve got now is the woman in the burka with the three different colors…

Stef: The woman in the burka is the double with the long horns, oh, that’s Claudia ‘billy’ Baca that’s the same girl that’s been on my albums for my last two records. It’s a picture of her standing on a frozen lake, then Eric just took the photo and then scribbled out everything except for her hands, scarf and face, so it looks like a burka, but it’s not, it’s just sharpie.

Pastepunk: How much fun did you have with ATMOSPHERE?

Stef: I had a great time. We hit a lot of markets I’d just been on on the Never Better tour and it’s great to see people who knew the words and were excited to throw their hands up and rock out. I had a really good time.

Pastepunk: Since by your own admission you used to be one of those kids that you made sure the bands knew you knew all the words what’s it like being on the other side of that now?

Stef: It’s inspiring. It makes me want to make sure I keep as much thought on the words as I always have a lot of people kind of dumb it down and I realized that especially with Never Better not only did I not dumb it down but I’m actually more dense in a lot of places than I ever have been I’m doing a lot more assuming people know what I”m talking about and not trying to explain it heavily. I hope I’ll be able to keep on doing it like that. I like that better. I really like writing because I know what the fuck I’m talking about and then having people come yell that right back at my face and it means there’s at least a handful of people that get me. You know?

Pastepunk: Yeah…uhhhh…yes, I would assume, I’ve never been in a position where I’ve written things that people know. So when I say I know, I think I mean it.

Stef: I believe it.

Pastepunk: How did the PEARL JAM cover work out?

Stef: That came about because somebody at MTV2 contacted me

Pastepunk: Is that the MTV that still plays music?

Stef: Yeah, that’s the one, somebody at MTV2 contacted somebody who knew how to get a hold of me and I got an email forwarded to me that was like “they’re re-releasing Ten do you wanna do a cover of a PEARL JAM song?” and I sent something back saying “Do they know that I”m a rapper”?

Pastepunk: Can we put that one in big quotes, please?

Stef: Yeah, absolutely. I was like, they know I’m a rapper? and he said yeah, this could be really cool. and I thought at first it was an audio cover I thought that I was just going to remake this song. I covered “All Along the Watchtower” a few years back – I pretty much took the words and turned it into a rap song. I figured I’d do something similar and then when I heard it was a video cover, I was like, well, I can’t do that in order to rewrite someone else’s song and make it worthwhile, but if it’s a video cover, I may as well just straight up cover it. I just made the beat, my friend Ben came over with his camera and I just played the song, played the guitar solos on my keyboard and that was that.

Pastepunk: One of the guys who runs Punknews likes that cover…

Stef: I like Punknews. I subscribe to Punknews’ Twitter. I follow.

Pastepunk: He’s the reason why I bought the record. Well, one of the other reasons why I bought it…

Stef: Tell him I said thanks for that, too.